Its been quite a week in the Sphell .
The domestic game is never boring I’ll give it that .
Neither is following Celtic and Im hoping the two are not always entwined.
It would be easier to list those that arent fighting but Im not gonna .
Seems everyone has a bit of skin on the game and is throwing in their tuppence on the big S word , Sectarianism .
But is it plain old simple sectarianism doing the rounds more and more over there ?
When weve seen Italian Catholics not getting any abuse and indeed liked for their skills , then it makes me question whether sectarianism is the correct phrase.
Racism towards those of Ireland or Irish decent is probably closer to the mark , but again isnt exactly correct as you can be an Irishman playing for a midtable club and have a normal life .
Someone somewhere will know the correct phrase or term for whats going on , I certainly dont.
Yesterday seen those that love a statement issue two , one from chairman and one from its largest fan group , and surprise suprise they pussyfoot around and wont accept any blame.
That they have done all they can over at Ibrox is a double edged sword imo.
Take Morelos ( not even on a free ) for instance ,,, his profile doesnt fit the traditional type , but he has bought into the kultur over there and so is cool and the gang .
Roll with it and you will be fine it seems. He could be held up as being proof of being tolerant by a section if they wanted . Thats one side , accept an outsider ( even one not traditionally fine ) if they tow the line and embrace WATP.
The other edge of that sword is a heartless outsider waltzing in and saying ” oh well if youve done the best you can and thats all the damage youve done then its only right I take control of the issue here “
They should be more careful with their words.
However the Sfa are seemingly like a dog with a bone , meeting with cabinet secretaries and ministers for sport etc . We can expect action now the big boys have been brought in right ?
I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall at the meeting . I wonder did the Sfa claim they are only victims of society and pass the buck to the lawmakers , or were they told to clean up their act before they were forced to ?
Or perhaps they sat down to agree which laws needed tweaked to help ease the current ill feelings that exist out there .
Ultimately though for any Hoop its good news that things are being scrutinised and that there are more than ourselves showing an interest in what emerges .
On paper the top tier should be fantastic fayre , many good managers in there now , and with the general increase in sports science those recruited should be in better shape than ever , both of which should be bringing us a quality division .
That its relatively neutral Stevie Clarke that has been rocking the boat will not be music to some media influencers ears no doubt , and neither will his utterings that he hasnt been put off Scottish football.
The more voices of sanity the better , although I think those who wish for him in our dugout in the future havent a snowballs chance in hell , especially after this week .
As far as any change goes tradition holds that what happens now is a dramatic incident or two during the weekends games will take precedence, or will be hyped up enough to take the headlines for a few days , or at least until the next Brexit crisis , and hopefully the clamour for change will dampen down enough to move on .
Prepare for the weekend squirrels everyone !
Fancy helping out the site by writing something ? We try to publish any and all fans views .
The Irish are not a distinct race. There is no 1690 gene.
Sectarianism is the correct adjective to describe the overall ignorance.
I think the Scots-Ulster are,if not a distinct race,a definite distinct something. Certainly sharing a different mindset even if not a different DNA from most of the rest of the island,and from the world if it comes to it.
They even speak a different language if you listen to it-because the Nationalists speak Gaelic as well,they have a more lyrical lilt to the tonality,the loyalists growl.
It’s like me saying Accrington and Almore saying Yeovil. Think about it,you’ll see what I mean.
Good site lhads, keep it goin. ✌
Good luck and, Hail! Hail! ?
hi kev long time no post, anyway just read back, I completely agree with TET, even if we stopped singing irish republican songs, and did not bring the tricolour with us wherever we went, ill go further even if we all started bringing in the butchers apron, the bassas would still wont to kill us its in their genes, they hate anything to do with the roman catholic church, as they see us being all papists and the no pope of rome equation, and irish catholics well we will all burn in hell,.no until the orange masonic influence dies out in Scotland we will always be at the back of the bus fuckin sad really.hh.
The problem with Scots Ulsters is they are guilt ridden. They are defensive. They know, as the rest of the world knows, they got their ill gotten gains through the shameful plantation in Ireland. They were defended from their position by bastards like James 1/6, Cromwell, Churchill and now Theresa May. They know they are hated by all good thinking people. That’s why they ‘growl’. On the other hand, Irish people, who happen to be Catholics, are loved the world over. That’s why their voices are ‘lyrical’. This makes the Orange people jealous. But there is nothing they can do about it so they club together and march. To show solidarity in their shame.
It is in some ways understandable why Celtic supporters should want to retaliate against their poisonous songs and chanting. But there is better ways to deal with them than being a 90 mins. republican.
Join a political party. Join a trade union. Join the Police, the armed forces. Become active. Make sure we are part of the establishment. Overwhelm them. Write to people – like I have – to The Archbishop of Canterbury, Prince Charles, Tony Blair and state our case. If you want to be public attend James Connelly days in Edinburgh. Have a ball at the Barras with the Wolf Tones.
I just don’t think a football match mixes well with politics. We are a club open to all.
BP, I certainly don’t sit at the back of the bus my friend. I am proud to be a Tim and argue our side whenever I get the chance. The orange order is for scums. I know it, deep down they know it. I am way above them. They can sing their songs all day long it matters not. I laugh at them.
“I don’t think a football match mixes well with politics”
With all due respect, my friend, I could not disagree more.
They have always been linked;Going back to the Roman circus Maximus,sports were used to emphasize loyalty to one’s own tribe (class), Gods and political leaders.
There are lots of studies on the correlation between sports and politics, but my favourite place to start is usually old Noam
It is not necessarily that we should separate politics from sport. Before we try to do that, we first have to understand how and how deeply they are connected.
Interesting Mike. “Leads to irrational jingoism and submissiveness to power/authority. A very dangerous thing”. “To dull people’s brains”. “Reduce their capacity to think”. “Indoctrination”.
Mmmhh. All he did was ask the question ‘why do I support the high school team, the school which I attend?’
Maybe he has overthought this.
The problem with Noam’s argument is that he approaches it with the assumption that, in our case, football fans are dullards. I take the opposite view. You only need to spend a day on Celtic blogs to realise they are mostly intelligent. My simple take on it is that a football ground is not the best place to tackle sectarianism, racism, bigotry, homophobia etc. It’s out there in the wider world. At home, at work, in the media and dare I say it, in the courts!
I have often been accused of overthinking things … which, apparently, is not the same thing as thinking too well!
I hope to live long enough to see the Green Brigade do a Noam Chomsky/Celtic banner one day!
You Mike, are a very naughty bhoy! 🙂
I disagree. One only has to read anything he has written to see that NC often deals with structural problems. Plus, while he is obviuolsly aware of the bad that is done, he has an unwavering belief in the capacity of people to be good and to do good. As a libertarian socialist, this is almost axiomatic. Plus he has spent his life fighting the good fight, and encouraging everyone to challenge what they are told and think for themselves. This assumes that they are capable of doing so, and as such, are anything but incapable of understanding.
As far as football grounds, 52,000 people singing about fenian blood is much more obvious than being overlooked for a job because of the school you went to. And, as such, should be easier to identify and stamp out. Let’s take our victories where we can, and use those as a springboard for the next stage of the battle.
Have to take young Seamus for a walk. Chat more later, mybfriend
The other day i suggested that the twitter video doing the rounds justifying Bachman’s red card looked doctored.
Having watched the official tv footage from behind the goal his arms went up once.In the hun twitter version from the side there are two movements one to elbow with hands going up and then a second hands up movement plus the speed looked strange.
My son who is a film school graduate and stepdaughter who is studying film at college both said it was clearly doctored when i sent them the link.
Those cheating huns have no shame or limits.
The overturning of Bachman’s red suggests i was correct as the twitter video had him clearly guilty.
While i am no expert on editing phone videos in my 30 odd years in advertising i have worked on hundreds of tv commercials and understand how easy it is with modern technology to manipulate images.
I hope Celtic employ an expert at least as a consultant on video technology as these scumbags will do everything they can to cheat.
MIKE IN TORONTO
Would happily chip in for that banner.
Unfortunately, the issue, which is serious, is already being diluted. The fact that Boyd appeared along with Clarke illustrates how it will be treated. It is no longer a Sevco issue, it is a West of Scotland issue, soon to becwidened to include other clubs.
Pitch invasions, sectarian singing, coin/battery throwing, damage to seating etc ……these are now SPL issues not specific to one club. Even although the facts show who are the main originators, it will be a Scottish problem now. Agreement for change will involve more parties, hence making it more difficult to achieve consensus and action. Further, it will be impossible for Celtic to escape a measure of blame.
Wait and see.
I know exactly what Clarke is talking about. My sons cannot understand what goes on in Scotland w.r.t sectarianism, including their father’s jokes about the dumb Rangers fans. I, too, am glad that they are out of it.
If real change was their aim i would be all for it.
The convenience of the Boyd situation gave them the perfect opportunity to react.
When a hun threw a battery at a Celtic players head.another attempted to attack Brown then subsequently shat it and S Sinclair was racially abused all in one game that was the time to act.
Why didn’t they????
Where was the outrage in the best wee country????
Why am I not surprised that you are a Noam fan? I knew there was a reason I liked you?
Have you seen these? gnome chomskies for the garden. Keeps squirrels and republicans out of the garden
I love it.
My wife is in charge of the garden so may need your help in persuading her we need one.
Your wife is a lawyer, so she is surely into politics. You married her (or she married you) … either way, I am assuming she would not have done so unless she had similar views to your own… so I am sure she would just love a Chomsky statute!
In fact, when is her birthday? Anniversary?
Thanks for the compliments and please give us your thoughts sometimes.
Hope the health is good partner. Take it easy.
Me too Kev. Hope you keep well.
I think my accent bamboozled her.
Her dad was a doctor who had stints in Aberdeen,Edinburgh and Glasgow so she had Brigadoon like romantic notions of us Scots.
The more she understands me the less enamored she has become.
Rebus I think but havent counted that the majority of posters on these Timmy pages have taken themselves to flight , moving away from where they ( we ) were born.
Theres a multitude of reasons but once I tasted freedom I knew I wasnt for livin there again .
That freedom included but was not limited to colours , employment , no ceiling on opportunity etc etc .
You know what I mean . So basically in our actions we , the majority , show we agree with Stevie Clarke I think its fair to say .
Seems a real nice guy , if the game cant get behind an untainted professional saying its broke then it needs to slowly die , or possibly deserves to slowly die, but death will be the result of this malarkey if it continues.
Clubs will go to the wall over lack of interest from the next generation as they werent hooked young enough like many of us , and the next set up saying its ok we fixed it come back ,, well that aint gonna work. They will be abroad doing well like many on here.
Its the time , there does seem a will for change . But then we all know what usually happens , lip service and pandering . Im not getting my hopes up.
The crowd control company investigation into the crush has been missing for months now .
End of season release ? Brexit weekend maybe ? the old tactic is burying everything on a bad news day?
Hope alls good pal , stay warm
howdy pal . Did you happen to see the news about the Padres ? 300 million big ones they spent !
I happen to have a Padres shirt here and have been to a few games , one year we were really good I remember .
I guess with the Chargers leaving town they see a big void and aim to take those fans . Stadium only hold in the 30k’s though but Im sure theres a plan in there somewhere.
When the Padres are taking players from the Dodgers then times they are a changing .
And then the basketball wonderkid injured himself after his NIke basketball boots ” expolded ” under his feet !
Been an interesting sports week all round. A Liverpool win tomorrow would be a huge step in taking the title from Peps lot.
Take it easy
In other news the mother in law announced she is not only accompanying us to the old country but she is then taking a further trip over to Bonnie Scotland to go on the Outlander tour ( no doubt one of our wives has seen Outlander ) which will take her to the Kinloch Rannoch area among other places . My girls are going with her and all .
If anyone happens to see a stunning Californian in those parts , her mother is my wife ! 🙂
Anyone been in those parts ? Or has anyones wife done the tour ? 😉
Perhaps you could wake her up in the mornings by serenading her with a lovely rendition of Heather in the Hills!
(If Liam in Toronto were here now – he lurks, but doesn’t post – he’d be shaking his head at me, and muttering ‘and you wonder why no woman has ever been silly enough to marry you’
Gerry hit the nail on the head when he said that the real problem was the orange walks.
I have said the same thing for many, many years, the non Catholic population of scotland are indoctrinated into the Anti Irish hence anti Celtic mindset, politicians of all hues know that they are the vote winners, the scum who go to the bigot dome are insignificant, their numbers are not worth bothering about in the grand scheme of things.
Every single week in bonnie scotland the streets are awash with Anti Catholic marches, funded by the tax payer, stop them and at least there is hope, keep allowing them and things will NEVER change.
One thing I will keep saying to my fellow Celtic supporters, and this comes from experience.
Appeasement has NEVER worked in the past.
Appeasement DOESN’T work in the present
Appeasement will NOT work in the future.
We are dealing with wasp supremacists, these peepil are not like normal people, they exist to hate us, they hate us more than they like their club, please stop deluding yourselves that if we stop with the songs they will accept us, just don’t.
I totally agree with you on appeasement,it is a failed policy no matter where it has been attempted. Give someone an inch and they will take a liberty.
I don’t think that what anyone is suggesting amounts to appeasement;for me,what Stevie Clarke has bravely highlighted is that the terminology aimed at him and Kris Boyd amounts to a racially aggravated hate crime.
You can’t call someone a black bastard,as he pointed out. Nor,come to that,a dyke nor a Spic nor a Yid-with suitable apologies for even using those terms on here.
What he is pointing out is that the abuse aimed at them is officially condoned by the authorities in Scotland,because it is almost NEVER acted upon.
You try complaining to a policeman about being called a FB,see how far you get. And it is THAT which is the problem.
We need to stop it too,we need to stop responding with both barrels when we are confronted,we need to stop “manning up” and giving as good as we get.
We need to have the laws enforced,because otherwise people will be having this discussion in centuries to come.
Btw,I’m no shrinking violet in the face of such sectarian abuse,I’m well used to it. And even I think it has to stop-somehow or other!
HI GHUYS, listen im sick of saying this, my country of birth is a cesspit of triumphant orangeism and freemasonry,,now that is not why I left, I moved down to Liverpool and married a wee scouse girl who doesn’t give a feck about what religion you are, am I glad I left, too bloody right I am, I can walk down the street here with my celtic top on and nobody bats an eyelid, that’s the way it should be in Scotland but anyway you know the rest, hope you are all well.hh.
But the laws won’t be enforced, they even changed the law to capture the Celtic support FFS cos they knew that we weren’t breaking the law.
I’m sorry but we have to stand up to them, you can’t have it both ways, you can’t say we need to stop giving as good as we get and in the next breath say if we do they will take liberties, you have to make the choice, the back of the bus or equality.
Was talking to my stepson who is a basketball fan when news came out and said how the share price is affected will be the real interesting outcome.
I am no fan of the game but a few years ago i dated someone whose dad was a director of MSG.She tried to get me into the sport so went to a few Knicks games second row at the garden.Was bored and a few friends who spotted me on tv said i was looking at the crowd and not the game.
Baseball is strictly about going on a sunny day, eating food and watching replays on the big screen.
Ice Hockey is the only American sport i like to go to.
Went to a few Red Bulls games but it all seemed to manufactured to me
ghuys we could go on discussing this till the cows come home, bottom line is my country does not like my football club or my religion, now the big question what can be done about it, ill give you the answer in one, nothing, they hold all the aces the protestant majority, its so feckin sad.hh.
I think it was Mahe that mentioned a good few posters on here obviously don’t live in Scotland… reading some comments I think it’s a different country from the one that I reside in, as TET mentioned the hate marches are at the root of it all, the bigotry is taught in the homes so not sure how that can ever be “fixed” but trust me it’s on the wane, living my whole life in Coatbridge, this is a targeted area for the bigots to walk their Queens highway (fit them to better to pay their taxes) all the ”bawnds” that leave from this area are usually bussed over from the 6 counties during the marching season…. there used to be hundreds of bawnds with thousands of hinger ons…. these days it’s laughable they used to start at 8am then return at 8pm, nowadays even though still infuriating they have to be back on their buses around 4pm… it’s not perfect and the Huns going bust, Scottish independence & now Brexit has given them something to cling onto… at last elections under “orange order” request their followers were advised to vote Tory to help keep the union … again no back of the bus for me I prefer to laugh and then laugh a bit more and even better they know am laughing and why ….
Unlucky the day with the ole couponeers … one of these days 🙂
Southend had one shot on goal,and scored with it. I’ve had a fairly decent record this year,much better than last year,but that’s twice my selection has drawn and scuppered the coupon.
Angry disappointed and embarrassed.
Re the sectarianism and bigotry,you too are correct on saying that it is on the wane in general. But it is becoming more and more vocal in small concentrations,such as at the football. And think back,as an example,to St Alphonsus and how long it took to track down the one single offender who was charged,think about the original nothing-to-see-here reaction from Police Scotland.
What if the government said that all orange walks were banned in Scotland but that catholic schools needed to go as both were archaic remnants of a society long gone. Would you accept it?
Totally agree, but in years gone by the St Alphonus stuff happened all the time at hundreds of catholic chapels … at least it’s getting some air time … you know me my glass will always be well over half full … and I see it getting less and less before my own eyes
Not sure where you are going with that one 🙂 …. am a bit biased here but these days catholic schools are open to all and parents can decide if they want their kids taught there …
Orange walks / Education… surely even your good self can see the irony there… there is no hatred taught in any schools in my opinion the hatred is in the home
No government will alienate 70%+ of their electorate… wish I had posted that first 🙂
I dont think taxes should be used for religious education or to protect/enforce orange walks.
Fair enough … catholic schools are not just in Scotland … apart from the 6 counties, orange walks are mainly in Scotland … I look on it as education the religious part is obviously the part you don’t agree on but still unsure why compare walks of hatred with education, but each to their own, it’s usually the Huns I hear complaining about schooling, most parents just want their kids educated in the best place possible
Mags et all
As you well know Catholic schools are the product of hate and division, they spout pish that they are the hot bed of sectarianism but they know fine well that’s a lie, they don’t want to integrate with the “Catholics”.
BP, I’m sorry mate I have to disagree. I spent most of my working life with 2 PLCs and a government agency and was promoted time after time. Never a problem. Apart from my tim pals I had about 5 or 6 ‘Rangers pals’. Never a problem. There was no ‘Triumphant orangeism’ allowed in my company nor offered!
IMHO The issue is taxes and what they are used for.
IF hypothetically we could get rid of both I’d do it.
Next you’ll be saying that Muslims dont want to integrate 🙂
Don’t they !!!!!
Increasingly our local Catholic primary school is populated by protestant children. By the choice of their parents! I know the kids are no longer indoctrinated in the way we were back in the 50s & 60s but it is a move forward. The thought of protestant kids going to a Catholic school a generation ago would have been unthinkable. We were lucky, we always had the best education, hard though it was.
Young Muslim bhoy in my daughters class at RC school, I grew up with his dad and all of his uncles, he joins in with all school stuff but doesn’t get involved with the sacraments …
Right… too much airtime for all this stuff, not sure if KT is 100% fit to start but surely at Celtic Park Toljan & Johnny Hayes should be like wingers tomorrow… Motherwell have had a great start to 2019 in the league and will fancy their chances tomorrow be interesting to see if Ncham (if fit) starts