Rising Like Lazarus.

Morning,all. As we approach yet another international break,the Sentinel Celts brains trust has come up with the bright idea of running another one of our series of connected articles.

We all love a great comeback,and we’ve witnessed a few crackers over the years,so why not tell us all about your favourite? As an introduction to the idea,here’s one from way back when JIMMYNOTPAUL was still a young lad…

******

Is this Celtic’s greatest comeback ever? It surely has to be up there.

The 1903–04 Scottish Cup was the 31st season of Scotland’s most prestigious football knockout competition. The Cup was won by Celtic when they beat Rangers 3–2 in the final. The fixture may have been the point when the ‘Old Firm’ term began to be used in media to denote the relationship between the clubs, due to the increasing frequency of their meetings and the mutual commercial benefits of the growing rivalry.
There were over forty turnstiles working, and yet these were unable to cope with the thousands who besieged the gates. Long queues led up to all the approaches to the ground, and even when the game had started there were still thousands who had not got inside the gates. All previous records for a club game were exceeded, and the “gate” yielded £1400, which represents an attendance of sixty thousand spectators. The stands and reserved enclosures produced £400

A quite remarkable game from a quite remarkable Celtic team.

Rangers were leading 2-0, but Celtic managed to draw level by half time, and in the second half Celtic were rampant with the great Jimmy Quinn, also known as ‘Jamie the Silent’ because of his shyness off the field, completing his hatrick.

We pick the match report up at 2.2.

The play continued as fast as ever and the Celts did most of the attacking, beautiful play by the Parkhead forwards brought them near Watson, where a splendid cross shot by Muir was cleverly saved by the custodian. Only occasionally did the Rangers succeed in becoming dangerous, so frequently were the Celts attacking.

Fifteen minutes of the game had yet to go, and still the leading goal was wanted. Muir got the chance to score it, but, delaying to shoot, he was forcibly bowled over by Drummond.

That the Celts were the likeliest set to get the winning goal was seen by the dashing work of their forwards. Quinn all but got the point, for, having beaten Stark and Drummond, he was only disposed of by W. Smith at goal.

A long kick by N. Smith was met by Orr, who, after dribbling a bit, sent on to Hay, who in turn slipped the ball forward to Quinn. Catching it on the side of his foot, he sent it past Stark, and racing at top speed he made for goal. There was keen excitement us he sped on, with the Rangers’ backs running close on him, and endeavouring to charge him off. He, however, clung to the ball till within an arm’s length of Watson, when he softly tipped it into the net for the third time.

The supporters of the Parkhead side cheered lustily, and the Celtic players themselves, having got the lead, gave many signs of their delight.

The Jimmy Quinn Final” as it came to be know was played at Hampden Park, Glasgow before 64,323 spectators.

A native of the village of Croy, North Lanarkshire and signed for Celtic aged 22 by Willie Maley from junior club Smithston Albion in 1900, Quinn took several seasons to make his mark, playing at outside-left then inside-left before being moved to centre. Like so many players of the time and since, he was a coal miner.

Many thanks to Celtic Wiki and The Scotsman for helping me put this together.
Jimmynotpaul.

******

Grateful thanks to JIMMYNOTPAUL for today’s article-and also for the idea for the series. Come on,folks-we have a fortnight without football,somroll back the years and send us your memories of Celtic’s Great Comebacks!

Mail it to Mahe…

sentinelcelts@gmail.com

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Twists n turns
October 2, 2019 9:05 am

Big audio d

From previous thread:

It’s soul destroying bud. Fkn soul destroying.

John James’ ( I know he’s not well regarded at all times) recent piece on the referees is bang on . I’ll copy it in a minute for anyone who hasn’t seen it yet.

Twists n turns
October 2, 2019 9:05 am
BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 9:14 am

Copied over from previous article…
*
BIGAUDIODYNAMITE

Can anyone point me in the direction of my club’s response to the officiating of Sunday’s game? What, there wasn’t a word said ..again?! So we really have taken our place at the back of the bus agian, eh? I am now past the point of being scunnered with those tasked with defending our position. This has been a long time coming, but it has become impossible to keep contributing to this utter charade. Not one more thin dime! My love of football died a long time ago, my love for Celtic is akin to what an addict must feel. This is breaking my heart!

October 2, 2019 8:56 am

Big Audio Dynamite
October 2, 2019 9:16 am

I can only cut and paste wallpaper, apparently!

Thanks, Bobby!

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 9:22 am

TWISTSNTURNS

Some very good replies in that article,mate. It all reminds me of “Dougiegate”,dealt with in some depth here by THECELTICWIKI.

http://www.thecelticwiki.com/m/page/Controversies+-+Rescinded+penalty+and+lying+official+%28Oct+2010%29

Which of course takes us back to John Reid,and I hope OGLACH saw my late reply to him last night.

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 9:22 am

BIGAUDIODYNAMITE

I’ve got a wee flat down in Swindon if you fancy some practice…

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 9:24 am

Re the article and comebacks,I can think of a couple of 4-2 matches as well as practically every big match in the Centenary Season.

Plus a wee dayooooot in Lisbon…

Big Audio Dynamite
October 2, 2019 9:50 am

To add another dimension to my dilemma.

I have a 12yo son who is a carbon copy of me at 12 ..Cries when we win, cries when we lose. Now, how, in f@cking God’s name, do you go about explaining to a 12yo fanatic that we are done with this? I know some will say it’s only football, but Celtic has been a massive part of life since as far back as I can go. I have felt things while supporting us, that are hard to explain to those not involved. I have cried in stadia all over Europe, including spending £500 for the privilege of bawling my eyes out in the Porto end in Seville. I am now just tired and angry. I’m angry at everything, but mostly I am now just angry at the sneaky, greedy, spineless c@nts who are running our club. I used to console myself with the attitude that, we don’t want your favours, we will prove we don’t need help from refs, we would take on the coruption, head on, and beat it! The plucky underdog, is how I always viewed us. Now? Now, I can see it was all just an illusion. It’s blatantly obvious they are all in the same club(And yes, I mean they are all in the funny handshake club) and it is us who are being played. When I should be at my happiest, with my club going for a record we all covet, I find I’m empty inside and feel nothing but anger.

Ironyfc.

Big Audio Dynamite
October 2, 2019 9:53 am

Bobby, as soon as I’m done with my sister’s, my niece’s, and now my nephew and his gf’s new place, I’ll get right on that! Lol

jimthetim53
October 2, 2019 10:01 am

Bobby, BAD,

news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/c/celtic/9206945.stm

Read this article about John Reid calling out Scottish Referees and the SFA. Nov. 2010. He was Chairman of Celtic at the time. When have we ever heard anything remotely similar since then from anybody on the Celtic Board? The present lot are cowards.

jimthetim53
October 2, 2019 10:02 am

link not working sorry

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 10:06 am

BIGAUDIODYNAMITE

Ah,that old dilemma thang…

I had the same thing about eight years ago. I’d been at the Rennes game when we were charged with singing Up The Ra,under some imaginary and obscure charge. Can’t recall which,but the judgement was such that a first year law student would have won an appeal. In fact,the wording of it was effectively pleading for one.

Not Celtic,not PL. He accepted the judgement and rounded on the GB for being guilty of,well,nothing. I was right beside them that night,so I’d have noticed!

So I declared my dismay and anger and that I wouldn’t be back while PL was still there. Of course,that’s easy when I live in Swindon. Except that it isnae. My Dad and I don’t get the chance to go to the games together too often,and now I was gonna deny him even that dubious pleasure!

So how did I get out of it? Explained my dilemma on CQN-cos I was serious,btw!-and went with the replies from BADABING and DENA. Sod PL,it’s yer Dad that matters.

Same wi you,mate. Sod PL,it’s yer lad who matters. But take every opportunity to remind him of the snakes in our boardroom,that they will never be his friends.

Good luck!

PS-thanks,BADABING and DENA. Guess where I’ll be tomorrow night,and who with?

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 10:06 am

Duty calls…

Twists n turns
October 2, 2019 10:07 am

Big AD

I can honestly fully empathise with your feelings of despair. I reached the point you’re at in the summer. I just couldn’t bring myself to renew. Since then I’ve been all over the place emotionally. Am I missing the matches? You better believe I am.

I’m slightly more fortunate than you, in that, my kids are grown up and make their own decisions now. They chose to renew for themselves and my grandsons.

They all head off to the matches together. Me? I’m stuck looking for links to the matches, though at least in that instance, someone has been able to help me out.

It’s not the same though.

Emotional rollercoaster doesn’t come close to describing it. Initially I thought fff this – I’m renewing next season. Then we get weekends like the last one. Not the dropped 2 points. I know we can’t win every game. The refereeing though- was absolutely diabolical. Blatant and pre meditated.

So you think the club will flag it up now. Demand accountability. At least let the corrupt bastards know we won’t stand idly by and watch the cheating without comment.

Nothing. Nada.

What John J wrote post match I’d already highlighted weeks ago. The games v them will not be the key. The other 34 will be.

It’s as clear as it could be. It’ll only take another 4 or 5 weekends like last weekend and job done.

The questionable decision v the huns will come too. To prove these things “ even themselves out over a season”

The analysis will show dodgy decisions v them too. The difference? They’ll come for the huns when they’re 3 or 4 up.

Ours? Well we saw it last week.

It’s beyond belief that the club haven’t demanded a review of the refereeing performance in that match.

Bastards the lot of them.

The bottom line that matters to them is the one on their monthly payslip.

Pig sick of each and every one of them.

Big Audio Dynamite
October 2, 2019 10:13 am

Twists, cheers. I keep trying to convince myself, I might be wrong(Thom Yorke) but, you just know, in the pit of your stomach, you are right! To realise my club is part of this sick charade, has rocked my world to its very foundations. From the four leaf clover on my breast, to the green and white upon my chest, I am totally heartbroken. Dramatic I know, but it is what it is and I can’t deny my feelings any longer.

I love Celtic, God do I love Celtic, but I value my health and sanity more.

macjay1
October 2, 2019 10:49 am

BigAD ,TnT

Please tell us precisely what course of action you wish Celtic FC to take .
For example. Do you think Celtic FC should make a public statement accusing some or all Scottish referees of being cheats ?
If not , then what ?

Twists n turns
October 2, 2019 10:55 am

BigAD ,TnT

Please tell us precisely what course of action you wish Celtic FC to take .
For example. Do you think Celtic FC should make a public statement accusing some or all Scottish referees of being cheats ?

YES

macjay1
October 2, 2019 10:58 am

TnT
What do you think that will achieve ?

JimmynotPaul
October 2, 2019 11:06 am

Morning all.
Mahe, thanks for the kind comments. ?
I do wonder, if Big Packy has heard the tales of Croy’s finest, with his connections there.
I moved here 31 years ago and stay close, when I moved, it became apparent that folks were very proud of Jimmy Quinn and quite a few were able to say they knew of a Grandparent etc, who knew Jimmy. sadly through time, his legend is being forgotten.

JimmynotPaul
October 2, 2019 11:13 am

Jim.
From previous. Thanks for enquiring.
It’s where I was heading.
Every day off, that’s my treat.
Wife and quite often children, join me at the weekend.
However, on a day off, during the week, it’s just me. sometimes that is perfect.?
As a wee aside, I know the person who has the franchise.
Minx’s brother, another good Celtic man.

Twists n turns
October 2, 2019 11:15 am

I think it would result in 2 things ( or 3 actually)

1. A fine for Celtic
2. It’ll indicate they won’t sit idly by and accept the cheating
3. It’ll appease a great number of Celtic season ticket holders , and ex ST holders by assuring them the custodians of our club, and their money, won’t just ignore the efforts being made to deny us by unfair methods

jimthetim53
October 2, 2019 11:25 am

JnP, I’m so thick! Costa’s coffee! I was thinking Spain. LOL:)

macjay1
October 2, 2019 11:28 am

TnT
Just to be clear.
Im in complete agreement with you about the issue .I grew listening to my uncle complaining about a disallowed goal " scored " by Celtic. He had seen an action replay .............at the cinema.
Not much has changed.
I don
t think the course of action suggested would change a thing at the SFA.
It might however result in Celtic being dragged into court.
A charge of cheating is difficult to prove unless corroborated.
The guy was just incompetent. On the day.

Again, I hate to see good Tims walking away from Celtic.
Because the cheats would win.
Again.

jimthetim53
October 2, 2019 11:36 am

Macjay, Do you know the difference between a criminal court and a civil court? In a criminal court a judgement has to be beyond reasonable doubt. In a civil court – the type we would be talking about – it is in the balance of probabilities. A good statistician would easily, in my opinion, be able to prove in the balance of probabilities that Rangers are favoured and Celtic the opposite. Just as an example.

It would be worth it, even if we lost a case, just to see all the numbers and evidence out there in the public domain. To hear the reaction of the suits at Hampden, the media and other clubs.

macjay1
October 2, 2019 11:51 am

jimthetim53

And you think that Celtic FC should entertain the risk of the possibility of being forced into Court to prove an accusation of ” cheating ” against Scottish referees ?
I don`t.
Nor can I think of a successful precedent.

For me , the enemy is the SFA. Not the Celtic Board , whatever its shortcomings.

jimthetim53
October 2, 2019 12:00 pm

Macjay, I totally agree the main enemy is the SFA. But like a lot of other people I am angry that our board do not challenge them like John Reid did in 2010.

By the way, the SFA would never, ever, take a member club to a civilian court for anything to do with football. that is a mortal sin in UEFA’s eyes.

UEFA have turned a blind eye to clubs going down that route – like ‘the Bunnet’ – but not an association. The SFA would have to go through UEFA and or the CAS. Therein lies a problem for the SFA. Their dirty little secrets would be exposed. Which is why they are terrified to go to CAS despite being challenged to do so by Dave King.

Plus with The Rangers they also have the problem of the ‘5 way agreement’ which they (SFA) signed up to.

Lets not forget, at the CAS they would be judged by football, or at least sports minded people. Not lay persons in Edinburgh who are most likely members of a Masonic lodge.

Byres Road Bhoy
October 2, 2019 12:11 pm

Macjay. Good to see you posting an alternative view to that of the many malcontents in this site of whom, I must respectfully admit, I am one.
I don’t think things would necessarily wind up in court. For one thing, I can’t imagine the SFA would be keen to have its referees and organisation put under a microscope in public. For another, I am sure you would agree that Celtic FC has wordsmiths at its disposal who are capable of authoring a statement that suggests ‘cheating’ without actually saying so.
It’s a tactic that worked well for The Rangers in that they managed to make Willie Collum persona non grata at Ibrox for a few months after he aroused their wrath – mistakenly I am sure.
Personally, I would like to see this board raise its head above the parapet once in a while. Its reticence over the years has been noticeable and eventually disturbing.

jimthetim53
October 2, 2019 12:17 pm

It’s in the SFA’s best interests not to go near a court of any kind. All they need to do is shout back ‘It’s just Old Firm rivalry’. The media will wholeheartedly agree with them. Including all the EBT pundits.

So fire away Celtic, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Publish a book on it. Make a film out of it.

Big Audio Dynamite
October 2, 2019 12:30 pm

Macjay

I was kidding when I asked about statements. I expect none, but even when it happens, I know it’s just empty retoric. Football isn’t a sport or competition, it’s a money making scheme.

As soon as it was announced we would have to pay £50 for the privilege of watching us play the brand spanking new version of Rangers, that was the time for our support to say enough is enough. What actually happened was grotesque, and was the beginning of how I now feel today. It’s like the illusion of choice in politics, there is no choice, red or blue, they will have complete control over you, and they all belong to the same control system. I’m not remotely interested in what people like John Reid said in 2000 and blah blah, they are all full of shit!

Feels like we are all living our version of the Truman show. “We all just accept the world with which we are presented”

Sorry, Macjay, just gutted right now …HH

Auldheid
October 2, 2019 12:30 pm

In respect of SFA Reform I posted this article on Celtic Underground in June 2011.

http://celticunderground.net/sfa-reform-one-down-three-to-go/

I’ve made reference to it before on SC iro the Referees and that suggestion, along with the others ,stands the test of time.

I remember drawing it to PL’s attention at the time with a reply that it was noted.

The subject came up in April 2013 and the answer was Celtic needed leverage, which was subsequently provided by Res12.

Looking back the time to exercise leverage was in the 5 Way Agreement in July 2012 and it is that agreement in my opinion that stands in the way of the required reforms.

People like Petrie, now SFA President chaired the SFA Licencing Committee in March 2011 that accepted proof of no overdue payables that allowed a licence to be granted to RFC. Andrew Dixon now a TRFC Ltd Director was a committee member. The proof offered was false. There was no liability, potential or otherwise, at 31 March 2011 but there was a payable that was overdue at 31 March 2011 as UEFA define it.

Petrie and Dixon are still foxes in the henhouse, protected from investigation by the 5 Way and Celtic’s unexplained reluctance to insist on an independent enquiry into the workings of that Committee because the 5 Way removed justiciability* needs answered

(* yes I knicked that it from the Supreme Court prorogation hearings) and Wiki explains it as

” Justiciability concerns the limits upon legal issues over which a court can exercise its judicial authority. It includes, but is not limited to, the legal concept of standing, which is used to determine if the party bringing the suit is a party appropriate to establishing whether an actual adversarial issue exists. “)

In effect the SFA Judicial Panel Protocol was surrendered iro matters RFC by the 5 Way Agreement and Celtic can no longer hide behind the path they directed shareholders representatives along in 2013 when Res12 was adjourned.

Think of how are game would be now had the opportunity to make the kind of reforms suggested been taken by Celtic in 2012.

Short term thinking has long term consequences which are emerging with every repeat of the kind of events in 2010/2011 that saw the season of honest mistakes so that RFC got access to CL money to keep them alive.

Such reforms would have removed the factors that continue to undermine the integrity of Scottish football competition and those who do not learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them.

At some point, especially if the league is lost to skulduggery, loyalty might be left aside for long enough to force reform and in that respect our worst enemy is not the Board or SFA/SPFL, it is ourselves.

macjay1
October 2, 2019 12:35 pm

Lads
My motivation.
I just hate to see good Tims walking away from Celtic.
( So much so that I have had to put Boris on pause.)
Currently in Thailand promoting Celtic to the resort staff .
How ? Showing them vids. of the Thai Tims , whom they`ve never heard of.

Auldheid
October 2, 2019 12:36 pm

macjay1

jimthetim53
And you think that Celtic FC should entertain the risk of the possibility of being forced into Court to prove an accusation of ” cheating ” against Scottish referees ?
I don`t.
Nor can I think of a successful precedent.
For me , the enemy is the SFA. Not the Celtic Board , whatever its shortcomings.
========================

Who said: ‘If you are not part of the solution, you must be part of the problem’?

THIS IS a misquotation of Eldridge Cleaver. The correct (full) quote is: ‘There is no more neutrality in the world. You either have to be part of the solution, or you’re going to be part of the problem.’

Where would you draw the line on shortcomings of The Celtic Board?

When is it crossed?

Mike in Toronto
October 2, 2019 12:44 pm

I see the old communist Macjay on here spouting his socialist rhetoric ….

We made and had money ….Rangers needed money … so, they stole from us, and the central authority let th

Mike in Toronto
October 2, 2019 12:45 pm

m keep it … ?

jimthetim53
October 2, 2019 12:46 pm

Mike, I was having fun ending that sentence for you! Mines was much funnier 🙂

macjay1
October 2, 2019 12:49 pm

Auldheid.
I refuse to be judged by cliche.
I`m a simple Tim who has no direct knowledge of the inner workings of the Celtic Board.
As to their supposed ” shortcomings “, I know less.
I do know known unknowns which others seem to count as knowns because they seem to know.
🙂
One other thing . I trust the Board to do what is in the interests of Celtic.
The minute I have evidence to the contrary , i may change my view , but the only evidence I have currently is the league table.
For the last eight years.

macjay1
October 2, 2019 12:54 pm

Mike in Toronto

Without a word of a lie , Mike.
I love Jeremy.
Sure you know why .
🙂

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 1:00 pm

MACJAY 1249

The problem I have with your thoughts that the only thing that matters is the league table over the last eight years is,I think,pretty obvious. To wit,the league table over the last twenty years as an example.

Rangers cheated to win their titles during that time. That is without dispute. The board did nothing then,they are doing nothing now.

You suggest we shouldn’t speak up because we are winning? I suggest we should ALWAYS speak up. Whether we are being cheated or not. Lie down to injustice and the perpretators will walk all over you.

We aren’t simply lying down to it-we are facilitating it. And encouraging it. It will be too late to complain when your eight years of league tables are a distant memory and the freshest thing in our mind is being cheated out of the latest one because we said eff all.

jimthetim53
October 2, 2019 1:01 pm

Macjay, I was speaking to OldTim at the hoot. He was very much minded like you. We all have different priorities I guess.

Enjoy Thailand. Spreading the word of Celtic and the Thai Tims.

RIP Reamonn Gormley.

macjay1
October 2, 2019 1:01 pm

Big Audio Dynamite

Sorry to hear that.
Stick with it , BAD.
Celtic are worth it.
Celtic are primarily the punters , not the Board.
And the punters are also worth it.

Bada Bing
October 2, 2019 1:09 pm

Gough only over to try and punt Boy David to the MLS…

Byres Road Bhoy
October 2, 2019 1:16 pm

Macjay. Keep up the good work in Thailand. ?
You said:”One other thing . I trust the Board to do what is in the interests of Celtic.”
I trust the Board to do what is in the interests of the PLC and would contend that that in not always in the interest of Celtic.

macjay1
October 2, 2019 1:19 pm

Jimthetim53

Met the Thai Tims lady in Bangkok at the huns game.
Lovely classy lady.
She couldn`t have been more complimentary about Raemonn.
As you say, may he R.I.P.

macjay1
October 2, 2019 1:21 pm

BRB

Thanks.

I take your point.

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 1:24 pm

MACJAY

Keep up the good work in Thailand,mate. Spreading the word as good Tims do.

macjay1
October 2, 2019 1:33 pm

BOBBY MURDOCH’S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

Speak up all you wish. That goes without saying.
The issue is good Tims stopping supporting Celtic because of what they consider to be Board inaction.
Thats what Im on about.

fan-a-tic
October 2, 2019 1:33 pm

Watching tv this morning and the advertisements make it obvious that the posters on this forum clearly misunderstand and therefor cannot fully appreciate our wonderful plc.
I have seen ads for all kinds of corporations (insurance,,drug companies, lawyers ,medical, food and cars)
and every one of them clearly has only the customers best needs and interests at heart.
Rampant profiteering is just an odd little aside.

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 1:36 pm

MACJAY 133

Agreed. And the number of disaffected Celtic supporters with a lifelong affiliation should be a major worry. Yet it seems to matter not a jot to the board that have pissed them off.

IvorytowersCSC

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 1:37 pm

FAN-A-TIC

Odd,indeed. And entirely coincidental,I’m sure…

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
October 2, 2019 1:38 pm

Ah well. Duty calls again.