You live and you learn

With no major news within the rudderless ship Celtica, I started pondering some of the lessons already available from this disaster of a season, in the believe its never too early to analyze what exactly went so badly wrong.
Of course the season from hell still needs to play out but there are some available right now to be absorbed, nothing that happens from here on in will change that.

 

Firstly we should have learnt never again to keep players when their heart isn’t in it. I almost types against their will but seeing as Neil confirmed he personally sat down with players and convinced them to give it one more push that would be inaccurate. But its as plain as milk some just didn’t turn up at all.

 

Odsonne is the obvious choice. If we had forked out 9million for the Eddy we currently witness there would be major recriminations, that’s how bad he has been. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and all that but can anyone honestly tell me Johnny Hayes and big Craig for another year wouldn’t have helped boost morale and/or instill some fight within the troops? Some may include Jozo in the list although with a quarter of pitches plastic and a pandemic there was rationale behind his departure, but still if the players heart isn’t in it he shouldn’t be on the pitch never mind around the first team.
The correct mentality or attitude is a must to pull on that strip, I’m far from the first to realise that but it seems to have been arrogantly overlooked. Playing players who dont wish to be there costs us money and titles, it should end right here right now.

 

Secondly, the summer reshuffle must deliver a media department. We are a punching bag at times despite at least occasional evidence of all being done board. The Ibrox bunch had employees who were masters of getting ahead of the narrative, something deemed essential these days.

 

Our preferred drip method to a certain writer or blog must end as we all deserve transparency, to hear the message directly, not selectively. I’m hoping the fresh blood to be installed at boardroom level are more modern, technologically savvy folk who realise the benefits of communication across multiple platforms such as online fan access to our manager during press conferences.
The Gerry Mc Coullough easy interviews must end, are fooling no one and if anything are counterproductive at this stage.
Real faces issuing real info to the entire support please.

 

Lastly,,this season we learnt the faithful still have enough fire in their bellies to hit the Park if brought to it.
You’ve no idea how important this fact might be, now they know supporters will gather creating scenes the PLC would rather the world didn’t have access to.
Despite Covid-19, despite 9 years of success, despite friendly mouthpieces advocating nothing of the sort, the Tims got up off their asses and made their voices heard because this isn’t good enough, not by a long stretch of the imagination (and its quite an imagination that doesn’t forsee a VST sales collapse coming).

 

In hitting the Park those fans showed mettle, and threw down the gauntlet.
Sort it, or face a literal siege, that’s the message sent by the crowd.
Well done.

 

Above by Mahe

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Celtic1member1vote

Just a wee reminder folks .. Celtic Trust members meeting tonight at 7pm on Zoom ..

Chairbhoy

Bobby Murdochs @ 10:08 pm,

“CHAIRBHOY

I checked the score with five minutes to go. 1-1

Unlucky,mucker.

Yes, they gave a good account of themselves, no doubts, up against £200M + of fire power, something was going to give – shame they couldn’t keep the score respectable though.

Good lead Mahe,

As I have been in a state of “acceptance” for sometime the games have seemed rather odd surreal even.

A few seasons back on one of those “selective” sites, I said that there was holistic problems at Celtic… that thought was deemed “pretentious”.

I ventured at the start of this season the same, Celtic’s challenges were holistic… same response – “pretentious”

I believe all but the most short-sighted, the most gullible and the most malignant of couriers can now see and understand the holistic nature of the issues Celtic face.

Without a real and concentrated action from the support these men of avarice and their sycophants will continue to destroy something their small-mindedness can never truly comprehend.

Hail Hail

GER57

Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Celtic’s current malaise illustrates this dictum perfectly. PL has been CEO at Celtic for 17 years and he considers himself the “smartest guy in the room.” Therefore he micromanages everything that happens at CP. Such concentration of power in a 21st century business the size of Celtic is simply unsustainable. No individual has the ability to be chief accountant, director of football, contracts manager, HR manager, PR manager and interior designer. Jack of all trades and master of none. He seems to have a tunnel vision focus on the short term bottom line. Penny wise, pound foolish comes to mind. I’ll bet my bottom dollar that none of DDs other businesses are run in such a fashion. Yet DD must have OK’d this management structure. If both the Chairman and CEO have decided that keeping a Rangers in place is essential to our business model, knowing full well that many, if not most of, the fans wouldn’t accept it, then it makes sense to restrict decision making to as few people as possible.
Well, the chickens have come home to roost in this of all seasons. What a spectacular own goal.
PL must go. There MUST be several capable candidates out there ready and willing to be our CEO for a fraction of PLs salary and bonus. I’m sure a few will be “Celtic minded.” Only then can we compete as a modern, progressive FOOTBALL CLUB.
Remember the film made to celebrate our centenary? I think it was one of Bob Kelly’s daughters who reminisced about counting the gate money on the living room floor on Sunday afternoons. Whilst that doesn’t happen today, a similar contemptuous attitude towards the fans still exists at director level. We need to get rid. Period!!

Thetic

I slept through the SC chaos yesterday.Wish I had done a Rip Van and slept through this season

Garry

Mahe
Very good lead article. In looking at the collapse, or fall from grace this season, I keep thinking to what my late father used to say to me during our barren years of the 90s. My dad was a goalkeeper in both football and hockey teams. He used to say that a good goalkeeper could gain a team a dozen or more points over the course of a season, and in some cases, win a team silverware in the cup competitions.
On reflecting on the 2019/2020 season, it is very apparent that Fraser Forster was worth at least a dozen or more points for us over the league campaign, helped us almost singlehandedly to win us the League Cup Final, and help us top the group in the Europa League.
Craig Gordon similarly, was very important to us in gaining the extra points needed to win trophies in the seasons prior to last.

We found ourselves in the position of not having either to choose from, at the start of this season. We recruited a £5 million Dutch born, Greek international keeper. On paper it looked good business, but has not worked on the pitch.
Confidence in a good goalkeeper will always help a defensive back line. The opposite is true.
I am in no way suggesting that all our problems this season are down to the goalkeeping position. The loss of Damien Duff to the coaching staff maybe an even bigger cause of our drop in form and performance levels on the pitch.
But I keep coming round to the words of my father, about having a top class goalie in the team to gain the advantage that wins a team league and cup trophies. He was possibly biased, being a goalkeeper, but his mantra was that goalkeeper was the most important position in a team.
We don’t seem to have a good keeper to choose from.
Time to try big Clydebank bhoy, Celtic daft Ross Doohan?

Garry

Ger57
Good post mate. Peter Lawwell indeed must go.
Who is his replacement?
My dream team to replace Peter Lawwell and Neil Lennon was Ralf Rangnick as CEO/Director of Football, and fellow German Thomas Tuchel as Head Coach. Looks like the latter is Chelsea bound. Therefore, RR in soon please, and to choose an up and coming German Head Coach.

Ger57, I remember hearing stories of certain Celtic directors taking home duffle bags, haversacks of gate receipt money home after games. Jock Stein looking astonished at the stadium announcement of today’s attendance figure. Understated by 10,000s.
It was all going on at a more primitive, obvious manner in those days. But it hasn’t gone away. I’m not saying I agree with a certain poster yesterday who reckons our books are cooked to an unbelievable level. A first year trainee accountant/auditor would see through that straight away. But plenty of firms use off shore accounts, money laundering, tax avoidance schemes like the EBTs and much more.
To be honest, for all their faults I don’t smell a rat in that area of Celtic. However their immoral and undeserving bonus scheme and salary for the CEO is there for all to see!
And don’t get me started at the old pals set up and tenure in the Boardroom. There is more than one interpretation of the word NEDs!

Auldheid-a-

Garry

Goal keeper, CB, CF form the spine of any decent team.

Celtic dont have one on the park or in the Board room.

Garry

JTT53
I don’t know if it was a true story, but my dad and uncles used to joke about the Kelly family and White family turnstiles.
All money from these turnstiles went to the Kelly’s and White’s respectively, the rest of the turnstiles takings being the declared crowd of the day, which went to Celtic FC.
My dad absolutely despised the Whites and the Kellys, especially Desmond White.
They were the reason he stopped going to Celtic matches with me in 1977.
The sale of Kenny Dalglish was the straw that broke the camel’s back for him.
He was angry about us selling Macari and Hay, but the sale of King Kenny and the treatment of Jock Stein finished him for good.

Garry

Auldheid
Very true.
On the pitch and in the boardroom, we seem to have the spine of a jellyfish.
Jellyfish FC at this moment in time.

Yeah heard similar Garry. Also the guys who worked in the turnstiles went home with a pocketful of money too! Who can blame them when they knew what was going on? I don’t suppose it was any worse from getting ‘lifted over’ to avoid paying for kids.

D R M

Auldheid the last time I spoke to you was before I moved over here about 7 years ago in middle of the ek town centre so regarding the eating of all the pies if you seen me now you would know I was the guilty one 😁

Auldheid-a-

Chairbhoy

“Holistic” reminds me of an article on just that subject I penned around 10 years ago.

The problem was there to see once I attended Open Meeetings.

Still there. Whilst CST are taking some sort of lead I see no signs so far of CSA joining the fray although I hear they are doing some soundings of members.

CeltsforChange 2021 based on a local CSC are indicative of feelings on the ground and I know of one other CSC that are also stirring into action.

I’ll look for the article and if it’s still relevant link to it.

I recall at one meeting when discussing the merits of a Membership Scheme with PL and henchman as a means of improving communication, hearing PL defend his open door communication strategy where he met regularly with the CSA and then the CST and individuals and my pointing out these were silos where the message at one meeting had changed two weeks later with another organisation, leaving PL open to accusations of lies (oh the irony of that with hindsight).

I also pointed out is communication method was one way and dialogue was needed and left him a copy of a document called The Decalogue Dialogue..

I’ll link to that as well. I’ve a treasure trove of articles I was reminded of when looking for the spreadsheet for hunskelper.

The saddest thing is I could probably republish some relatively unchanged because nothing much has changed in spite of the controlled Fans Forum.

When asked in a Q &A on the Celtic Star recently what change I would like to see my answer was in attitude on both sides of the fence.

Until then, until the realisation, that is everyone seeing reality, that Celtic are a holistic enterprise that has become fragmented into hundreds or thousands of pieces, a Humpty Dumpty who fell off the wall organisation, then little will change.

Auldheid-a-

DRM

You got me thinking now. I know who you arent . There was a lad in our office, a goalkeeper and Rangers supporter with a great smile who put on a lot of weight that made him even harder to beat at 5s and he was known as the guy who ate all the pies.

Garry

JTT53
I suppose you are correct.
Not sure it was morally right that turnstiles operators were stealing cash from Celtic, but then again, they were doing exactly what the custodians were doing, albeit on a smaller scale, if true.
I was lifted over the turnstiles from the age of 2, until about the age of 11.
This was probably morally wrong too, but since the age of 11 until I chucked following Celtic 18 months ago, I have spent multiple thousands of pounds on season tickets and merchandise for myself and my sons.
Had I not been taken to Celtic Park as a 2 year old in 1967, I may not even have turned out a Celtic supporter?

D R M

Auldheid I was waiting for the wife to come out a shop and when she heard us talking about celtic and res12 she left us to it cause she knew we would be a while.
I posted on cqn under same name which is just my initials and I used to be the skinny ankle biter when we played 5 s sides at John wrights. The goalkeeper was also known as moby pieshop (Alan W) nice guy.

Garry, whilst not condoning stealing, imagine you were a turnstile operator and you got it into your head that your turnstile’s money was going directly to one of the Whites or Kellys and not to the club. Their conscience might not be so troubled! 🙂

Garry

JTT53
True Jim, but two wrongs don’t make a right. 😊

Garry, LOL 🙂 Forgive me father!

Garry

JTT53
Hopefully the turnstiles operators stuck a good bit in the plate at Mass on the Sunday, and made a good act of contrition. 😁

D R M

Jimthetim the turnstile guys must have made a fortune from double shuffle money as well. I would struggle to get myself in the old turnstile these days but back then if you were too thin it would have been an advantage.

I’m sure they did.
That’s all that sorted out. See how easy it is?
🙂

D R M , Forgot about that! LOL 🙂

You did have to shuffle too!

D R M

Wonder how many double shuffles and lift overs reduced the official attendance. Maybe the board weren’t at it – aye right 😠

DRM LOL 🙂 We were all crooks together!

D R M

Haha forgive us all father

MAHE

Very good article,particularly re retaining players against their better wishes. Again,I’ll admit that I was delighted when we held on to our top players over the summer,but that was because I believed that the significance of this season had been explained to them,and the draw of being Celtic Legends had swayed their decision.

I fully expected that all of the players who had their hearts set on a move last summer would perform to their accustomed standard,then leave the summer after-having cemented their status with us and also with prospective new employees. That they would be fully invested in this season for the betterment of both the club and themselves.

This we have seen not to be the case. The players have wrecked our season,wrecked their hard-won reputations with the fans,and probably wrecked their agents’ chances of negotiating a bumper deal elsewhere in the summer. They haven’t just destroyed our prospects this season,but also their own for the three or four seasons to come. Again,such an outcome has me scratching my head. I don’t think the players have deliberately underperformed,but when your heart isn’t in it,that shows very clearly on the pitch. That extra yard in your head swiftly becomes Fuck it,I canny be bothered.

The lesson we have to learn from this is that when a player makes it plain that signing a new contract is not in his plans,we move him on. If he doesn’t want to pledge his future to the club,he is consigned to the past. If a player declines the offer of a contract extension,we accept it. It’s the modern way,after all.

No means no. Doesn’t matter how much you want it to mean yes.

GARRY

White’s treatment of Jock finished him in my eyes. Disgraceful and petty behaviour from a nobody who couldn’t wait to carry out a personal grudge.

Garry

DRM
JTT53 & I could still do the double shuffle at the turnstiles today.
An advantage of us both being tall and slim. 😁👍

D R M

The “official” crowds were a standing joke with the fans. “Must have been a lot of priests at the game yesterday”,etc. I remember sitting on the train home wi SOLKITTS after a game v Dundee Utd in the early 80s. I asked him how many he thought were at the game,bearing in mind we could hardly move for the 90 minutes.

50,000 easy,he said.

37,000,I replied. Betcha. At that,the guy sitting behind us burst out laughing and said-37,000 is the most for league games except against the huns. There was more than that in the toilets at half time!

GARRY

Dunno about that,mate. The current turnstiles are a nightmare,you can get claustrophobia in them just waiting for them to turn.

Like a modern version of The Iron Maiden.

Garry

BMCUW
You should have heard what my mother used to say about Desmond White, for the treatment of her hero Jock Stein.
Made my dad’s views seem mild mannered.

Garry

BMCUW
Managed it with my cousin Stephen from Leeds at a huns game 15 years ago.
He was up in Glasgow and we couldn’t get him a ticket. I am still the same shape and waist size.
Where there’s a will, there’s a way. 😜

Garry

BMCUW
Was that the Bank Holiday Monday afternoon game that Dundee United beat us?
One of the busiest days ever experienced in The Jungle for me.

D R M

Bobby unfortunately the players get too much money from an early age and know they will still get a good wage if they are sitting in the stand or in the treatment table.
This season also proves most players didnt care about the ten cause I’m sure it would have been rammed home to them the importance to the fans. In the past our players gave everything for the support (10 men won the league, centenary season, stopping 10, Lisbon lions) the list is endless.
Lazy and selfish players still get their moves even if it means downing tools until their contract ends. Any other profession or trade would see your contract ripped up for that behaviour but not for prima donna footballers.
Last month a Kilmarnock player said he wanted away and the manager was on tv saying he will continue training with the squad but will never play another game because he would rather play reserves who want to play. I couldn’t believe the interviewer was shocked at the managers attitude not the players spoilt attitude.
If an employee has personal problems which are affecting their work then they should be looked after as far as possible but just not wanting to work to the best of your capabilities because you don’t like the manager or tactics etc just sell them.

Garry

DRM
I really like Alex Dyer.
My kinda man and manager.
There is a bit of Old School about him.

D R M

Garry the newer turnstiles are a nightmare and dangerous if there was a crush as at least you could jump over the older ones. You and jimthetim must be like Hen Broon if you can get in them easily 😁. Alex dyer sounds like the kind of person who would back you all the way of you give 100% but if you slack you will know about it and nothing wrong with that.
Bobby 37,000 was always the crowd. Another classic was the Dundee game when they said it was full and there were people sitting on the track, up the floodlights anywhere they could get a space

Garry

DRM
Hahaha.
Jim and I are no quite a pair of Hen Broon’s.
That sounds like Glesga rhyming slang. 😂😂

D R M

Garry 😂😂 glad you knew who hen broon was

Garry

DRM
My Gran Delaney always bought the Sunday Post after Mass.
She would get me either the Broons or Oor Wullie annuals, as Christmas presents, on alternative years.
My daughter still has some of them. 👍

D R M

The Sunday post and the people’s friend was my grans papers n we also got the Broons n o or Wullie for Xmas but my dad always read it first. Happy memories.

bada bing1

https://twitter.com/CelticFC/status/1354001928523542529?s=08

The PR at this Club is an absolute joke….

Garry

Bada
Best manager we have had since Jock Stein.
Probably the best manager from the British Isles, working in football today.
How we miss Brendan Rodgers.

bada bing1

Garry- why are we sending him messages from official account?

bada bing1

Rumour Frimpong offski…

BADABING

You know my thoughts about Rodgers leaving,but there is no reason why we should wish him a happy birthday. Do we do the same for any of our other former managers? Not that I’m aware of.

As for Frimpers leaving,can’t say I blame him. Hopefully he will get better protection-and coaching-in his new workplace.

Garry

Bada
Not sure why?
Was just stating my opinion on Brendan Rodgers.
We wouldn’t be in the mess we are in, if he was still our manager.

Garry

Bada
Any idea where Frimpong is going?

GARRY

FC Lilliput?

Garry

BMCUW
😂 So he is leaving Jonathan Swiftly, and is off on his Gullivers Travels. 😜

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