Paradise Lost

 

Today gives us a guest article by M6BHOY,explain why he has lost his love of Celtic.

Firstly, some historical background about me.

I was born in Glasgow in 1956 into a Celtic daft extended family so it was quite natural that I would grow up to follow the same team that my maw, da, sisters, brothers, aunts, uncles, cousins, etc. all supported to varying degrees. 

I can’t remember the first match my dad took me to, but it must have been the early to mid-sixties. I always consider myself so lucky to have been weaned on the Lisbon Lions and the first and best Nine in a Row. 

It was indeed a great time to be alive.

 To me, supporting Celtic was an essential part of my life and it helped to sustain me and my pals
growing up in Castlemilk in the sixties and seventies. We were Celtic daft, and all had our heroes.


Mine was Bobby Lennox. 

We felt these heroes were also part of our extended family which of course they were.

I moved to England in the eighties and had two sons one decade later. I passed on The Joy
of Celtic to them both and one of the proudest moments of my life was taking my eldest son to
Seville in 2003. Even though we lost, we both felt we were part of something special and his younger
brother soon picked up the vibe and were both in the stadium that famous night when we beat
Barcelona. 

For most of my life, Celtic was a major part of me and match days dictated the rhythm of
my life to the extent that I never let anything else interrupt me finding somewhere to watch the
team either at Celtic Park or on the telly.

 I’ll cut straight to the chase now.

I’ve not been inside Celtic Park since August 2106 and I can’t remember the last time I watched my former heroes live on the telly, but I think it might have been the Rogic cup final in 2017. 

Despite the conveyor belt of trophies, I was becoming increasingly disenchanted with the way the club was being run by directors who had decided that the balance sheet was more important than the team sheet and the maintenance of the Old Firm business model was their primary objective.

In doing so, they were complicit in the biggest fraud in sporting history.

It allowed Deadco to come back from the dead and claim to have won their 55th league title last
season. I’m not going to rehearse of the arguments about the 5WA, Res12, Desmond’s statement
about Rangers having a fine tradition or Lawwell bemoaning the £10m. loss to the club not having
the blue half of the OF in the league-but bit by bit, I began to realise that the Celtic that I was born into
was changing into something I maybe didn’t want to be associated with any longer.

To me, Celtic was now the green half of the Old Firm brand that itself was predicated on the accumulation of as many bigot pounds the Tories in the boardroom could amass. This was a million miles away from the club founded by Brother Walfrid.

However, I clung on to the hope that eventually other supporters would re-discover the spirit of
Celts for Change in 1994 and remove the lying green Huns from the Celtic boardroom and return to
the days when the business existed to support the team and not the other way round as it does
today. 

Sadly, that hasn’t happened.

I know some here state that they renewed their season tickets to support the team and not the board. I understand the emotion behind that, but I think you are deluding yourself. I think the reality is, Celtic and to a lesser extent the OF, is an addiction and no matter how you frame it, you can’t do without it so the Board can and will do what they want with your money no matter how loudly you protest. You cannot separate the board from the team as the two are part of the same entity. 

Also, it smacks of the same argument the zombies use for claiming that it was a company not the club that was liquidated as they try and justify the continuity myth.


I’m sorry I just don’t buy any of that. 

To me if you give the club a blank cheque before a ball is kicked then you are supporting the board and their Old Firmist strategy.

Does anyone seriously entertain the notion that Desmond, Bankier, Allison, Wilson, etc are going to change how they run the club simply because thousands of customers waited till the minute before emptying their wallets into the PLC? If you do, then good luck with that! And the fact that tens of thousands did renew despite last season’s clusterfuck and lies from the board, finally extinguished the last flicker of hope within me.

I enjoyed the banter and camaraderie on this site but as I no longer consider myself to be a Celtic/Old
Firm supporter then I will leave you with my best wishes and move onto to find something else to do
with my time. I used to sing “We don’t care if we win lose or draw…”. 

Now, I just don’t care.

Grateful thanks to M6BHOY for this heartfelt article.

 

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Stephen

I too have not renewed my season book which I have held fir 40 years. The simple reason for this is I have had enough of the greed of this board. As a corporate season ticket holder I paid £3800 last year fir no access to Celtic Park. The Club then charged me £980 for the Virtual Pass. I complained that this was unfair to be charged double than other fans for the same product. I was told tough. Celtic had decided we would pay 25% of our annual cost as our seats were more expensive. I’m tired of being treated as a mug. Enough is Enough.

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

Thanks to M6BHOY for the article. A terrific explanation of why he WAS but no longer IS a Celtic fan-even though,deep down,he always will be.

I’m going to hit Admin to try to space it out better-that isn’t how he sent it,just hasn’t copied across properly.

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

STEPHEN

Welcome aboard. I’ve edited out your last name,for privacy.

In the box marked-“Name”-put the moniker you wish to be known by. It should autofill after that.

Big Audio Dynamite

Have Intepol not caught the mad petrol bomber yet? It’s been a while!

Aye …not sceptical enough.

cosy corner bhoy

Just finished yesterday leader.
Excelllent from ASWGL

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

BIGAUDIODYNAMITE

Whenever I got called paranoid,I always replied-

Just because I’m paranoid doesn’t mean the basterts aren’t out to get me!

Seems we just weren’t paranoid enough.

Big Audio Dynamite

And what about those who tampered with Morelos’ car? They should have been easy to find …just look for anyone capable of getting under a car that has 135mm ground clearance.

Aye …good trick that!

There seems to be a lot of criminals on the loose 👀

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

COSYCORNERBHOY

Mum turned her back on you again,or just nipped out for a smoke?

Don’t tell her we are due a heatwave here,starting today-you know how she hates to miss the good weather!

Big Audio Dynamite

Bobby, one of Dad’s fav sayings. He also always said- playing for Celtic was the equivalent of playing with one leg tied up behind yer ass😁

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

BIGAUDIODYNAMITE

What about the new Rangers bus that “Celtic fans burned to ashes”

Never a word of apology for that.

As for playing with one leg tied up behind yer ass,Willie Wallace said-

When I played for Hearts,we always knew we could get away with that bit more against Celtic. When I joined Celtic,I realised just how much more!

CFC

M6BHOY
Thank you for the heartfelt article.

Green and blue have shared a City and an ideology for over a century. The Old Firm.
What makes you believe the era you watched football was any different? Was cleaner?

Fans being fleeced has happened from Day One, as soon as cash changed hands – The dubious Reported Attendance figures back in the day.

It’s just that the numbers have gotten bigger.

Once you decide to accept the price of the product, the value of that product to you is set.

50,000 season books would suggest it is an affordable price to pay, to enjoy the product whether you are being fleeced or not.

The dilemma of knowing the custodians of the club you cherish are morally bankrupt ,and almost impossible to remove, has made the decision for you to renounce your support.

For others , the “faithful through and through”mantra is a bond that cannot be broken.

Neither viewpoints are wrong.

Thewildgoose

Excellent article M6BHOY, sums up perfectly how I feel too. I gave up my book at the end of the 8 in a row season. The final straw for me was the hampden shower scene. From the sheer joy of securing a treble treble to feeling utterly deflated with the news Lennon was to be appointed permanently. I won’t hand over a single penny of my hard earned to these profiteering tory bastards. That being said I find it too hard not to watch the team and stream just about every game.

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

I admit to being highly critical of the sloth-like pace of our transfer in-and-outs this summer,but it seems we are really ramping things up! News that Ajer is off to Brentford-?-followed by this.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-transfer-news/kyogo-furuhashi-join-celtic-ange-24546657

BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

CFC

Usually attributed to Groucho Marx…

“They are telling this of Lord Beaverbrook and a visiting Yankee actress. In a game of hypothetical questions, Beaverbrook asked the lady: ‘Would you live with a stranger if he paid you one million pounds?’ She said she would. ‘And if be paid you five pounds?’ The irate lady fumed: ‘Five pounds. What do you think I am?’ Beaverbrook replied: ‘We’ve already established that. Now we are trying to determine the degree.”

CFC

BMCUW

In that scenario the actress is being paid to perform a function, and her morals have a value to her.
Not sure how that relates to willingly paying for a product?

big packy

MORNING ALL and JIM m6 bhoy brilliant heartfelt post i was born a bit earlier than you 1953, and like you watched the lions, also moved down south in the mid 70s, im only up the m6 from you, but i feel and share all your pain, this is not the celtic i grew up with, i would not give the board a brown hapenny, if desmond goes id willingly buy into celtic again, H.H.

fan

BMCUW
Furuhashi looks quality on that youtube video.
Scoring goals with left and right foot plus headers and showing real skill.
Hope he can adapt to the WWE type arena that is the SPL.
First signing that has me truly excited and convinced Ange is determined to implement his style.

Squire Danaher

CFC 8:19

In the scenario the Celtic supporter is the actress.

Each has to consider how much they will tolerate at whatever cost.

M6BHOY

Great piece which I guess speaks for many on here.

I first harboured suspicions around 2010-11 when the Huns were in financial freefall. It remains to me absolutely inexplicable to this day how we managed to lose that game at Inverness on the Wednesday night to hand them the SPL on a plate.

I am a natural conspiracy theorist and convinced myself over the following years that we threw the 2011 title to keep the Huns afloat. My mates ridiculed me. Nonetheless I continued to pay my ST for the usual reasons. Day out, mates, supporting the product on the park etc etc.

Let’s all laugh at the Huns for 6 years etc etc. And take our eye off the ball as to what was really happening.

I think where it crystallised for me was after the first Rodgers treble when – in what we now suspect was REALLY the case – he found his aspirations for the club blocked by the other ego in the building. We all know the situation of that time.

I figured at that point that our custodians really aspired only to keeping that shower competitive. That meant that we couldn’t ‘leave them behind’. I have regularly referred to this over on the other place as ‘Operation Short Head’.

Winning the SPFL by 30 pts a season does the SPFL product no good. Familiarity breeds contempt. Win the league by 1-2 pts a season is the aim. From the lofty heights of the Rodgers peak, that meant only downsizing.

Our winning the SPFL by such margins does the OF product no good either.

The majority shareholder invested at a time when a move to England was being spoken of in less unrealistic terms than usual. Desmond’s only plan was and is EPL, which ain’t happening anytime soon. He is now bored with us and Lawwell’s job has been – and apparently remains – basically to run the club while turning a profit.

The OF is the only show in town. The Board know our feelings on this so give it the ‘not half of anything’, and humour us with ‘Glasgow Derby’ and ‘our opponents today’ nonsense.

Their response to the unfolding disaster that was last season – and the CL qualifying of recent seasons – is to gaslight us. We are so conditioned to this that we are actually pleased to have reportedly got £13.5m in for a player. To complain is to be ‘entitled’.

I know the world has moved on but when I was a wee Bhoy we would devastated at somebody leaving. I don’t remember cheering about receiving a British record transfer fee in August 1977.

With a less heavy heart than expected, I did not renew this season. The disconnect is so wide I overcame my emotional connection, or guilt trip.
A bit like stopping going to Mass as a teenager, or the first time I didn’t vote Labour.

I wouldn’t go so far as to say I’m at the ‘don’t care’ stage but I regularly quote Campbell and Woods talking about the late 50s-early 60s.

The opposite of Love is not Hate, but Indifference.

M6BHOY – I hope you reach a contentment with the club, I’m working towards that. 54 years man and Bhoy for me is some emotional investment that can’t and isn’t just going to go away.

Celtic are not going to hurt me any more though.

fan

M6BHOY
Excellent article straight from the heart.
I am an exile but gave up any cash input 3 years ago after cancelling the utterly crap Celtic tv.
I still support the ideals of Brother Walfrid but i cannot in good conscience give money to this PLC.
And while DD retains control i will continue with this stance.

bada bing1
fan

Squire Danaher’
The boasting about receiving large transfer fees was something that CQN conditioned the fans to do.
The same when words like amortization were used to tell us plebs/customers/supporters that we should shut up and leave the running of the club to those who know best.
Peter Lawwell used CQN to condition fans so he could do whatever DD required making himself rich on the way.
Ange will face the same difficult circumstances as Rodgers did if he brings success and if it leads to him being disillusioned and leaving the CQN propaganda machine will kick in to apportion blame to him and not the real culprits.
I posted on CQN for over a decade and in the early days i wrote a post asking for a more balanced viewpoint on how the club was being run.
I received a torrent of criticism from the usual and very little support for something that was in the supports interest.
It was and still is a well oiled PR operation.

saltires en Sevilla

Furuhashi video looks superb. He’s quick, hard working, two feet, shoots and scores…

The guy is dope..,,

Seriously tho’ watch the video.

CFC

Squire Danaher

Don’t agree.
Analogy doesn’t make sense.
Celtic supporter is not being paid to prostitute him/her self.

Prestonpans bhoys

Stephen @4:47am
That story is absolutely appalling and merely amplifies the pure greed of the club.

saltires en Sevilla

M6Bhoy

Everything you said buddy.

It hurts like hell.

Hope you can find a way- or reason – to get back -agree probably too much has to change.

We should not be losing guys like you.

Hope you keep in touch

Big Audio Dynamite

Stephen
How could any company think treating customers like that a good idea? If you tried to explain this to someone outwith Scottish football, surely they would say “Aye,right” incredible!

Squire Danaher

CFC
Squire Danaher

Don’t agree.
Analogy doesn’t make sense.
Celtic supporter is not being paid to prostitute him/her self.

———

It makes sense from perspective of the supporter compromising on their understanding of the club’s values and their own individual threshold of what’s tolerable and not.

Squire Danaher

For example

I may be prepared to turn a blind eye to them keeping a Hun entity in the game but ONLY up to and including the point where they ignore evidence of impropriety.

saltires en Sevilla

Hope this embeds – Furuhashi
https://youtu.be/YT15tdWB0Zk

McCaff – turns out I can’t do this my share function is kaput 🤪.

Can you repost with the correct format?

Big Audio Dynamite

I know we will never know the true figure (There’s no way to calculate it) but, how many real (Attendees) fans has the club lost because of the shenanigans of the last decade? I’d wager it’s now in the thousands.

How many times do you think that subject was broached in the bowels of Parkhead?!

They don’t GAF!

saltires en Sevilla

Big Audio Dynamite
I know we will never know the true figure (There’s no way to calculate it) but, how many real (Attendees) fans has the club lost because of the shenanigans of the last decade? I’d wager it’s now in the thousands.

How many times do you think that subject was broached in the bowels of Parkhead?!

They don’t GAF!

—///—-///—-///—-///

They don’t!

What chance they commissioned Cambridge Analytics to check out overall sample of support, and discovered only a few thousand would ‘walk away’ ( financial support)

Don’t doubt they have done their homework.

Stephen – hi buddy. That is disturbing news. Almost unbelievable, but still believable.

They really don’t need to give a fek.

Must be confident they have the numbers.

jimthetim53

Morning all & Packy.

M6BHOY, the least you can do is hang around with your pals on here. I always enjoyed your posts. Honest and relevant.

Big Audio Dynamite

Willie Wallace -Mid sixties: “We knew we could kick Celtic players and get away with it.

John Reid 2010- “We won’t be treated any different to others”

2021- So, surely we have a level playing field by now? No? Why?!

Uber Tim who is STILL Neil Lennon

A wee reminder of who you all turned yer backs on, in favour of this sleekit Tory board.

https://youtu.be/E5-wkcTyFNs

jimthetim53

Furuhashi looks like just exactly what we need. Here’s hoping.

Big Audio Dynamite

Satires
Fortunately for them our support base is massive. I think they would have known they were gambling, but were safe in the knowledge the numbers will ALWAYS be there. What has shocked me is the number of our fans who appear to want any Rangers team to compete with. The thing that really rips my knitting, is our meek acceptance that we should live with getting cheated every season! Why should we accept that shit?!

Squire Danaher

saltires en Sevilla
Big Audio Dynamite

What you are discussing is – as I understand it – exactly what Auldheid refers to as a “Moral Hazard”.

The Huns crash and burn. They get up and walk away while everyone else deals with the fallout.

Celtic are morally compromised to the point we are now being damaged by the increasing refusal of supporters to continue to fund a sham.

The other clubs turn a blind eye even when directly affected, eg Kilmarnock this week.

Squire Danaher

Big Audio Dynamite 10:08

I recall having an ultimately fruitless discussion with my neighbour in 405 – who I otherwise didn’t know – shortly after the Huns went bust. A pleasant guy always ready for a blether.

He was moaning that fitba without the Huns was rubbish. I patiently attempted to explain why they had gone bust. I added that they had cheated us for years by signing and playing players they couldn’t afford through downright fraud.

As what I thought would be a ridiculous example, I asked what he would think if they’d signed Messi and Ronaldo (both then at the height of their powers) and paid them the wages they were then on elsewhere by way of HMRC fraud.

His response was to the effect it didny matter, they would still be Rangers and we would still need to beat them.

I gave up.

I think that those of us who frequent cyberspace and talk to ourselves in echo chambers tend to forget what some other people actually believe and/or care about.

Big Audio Dynamite

Squire
I remember when Rangers were circling the drain, one of our own said we would be the real losers. I think people would still get a shock, if it was revealed how closely linked we are with the ugly sister from Govan. The 2 of them have been in bed since the beginning.

Big Audio Dynamite

Squire, I don’t believe a word that comes out of CP – I was sceptical about SB numbers too – but it we have sold nearly 50k, that’s a lot of people who need to turn a blind eye(Suspend reality) , just to try and enjoy their football.

I sometimes wish I could just ignore all the other stuff and just enjoy Celtic …I cant.

Big Audio Dynamite

Squire, my best mate is still insisting that Scottish football f@cked Rangers over, and no amount of truth will change his mind.

I don’t need to tell you … he is a moron ☺

ASWGL

Enjoyed M6Bhoys article, yet it was sour reading to hear of another fan with a love of the football club but not the shenanigans of the board walk away, as others have said M6bhoy don’t be a stranger your input is always valid.

As for Furuhashi he will become another Nakamura (not playing style) but as the most kicked player in the SPL, as was Naka

For Saltires

Maestro Fan

Have huge sympathy for this as a fellow Castlemilk bhoy (left in 1977 myself). I have nothing but contempt for the values of the PLC and their shills. I didn’t renew and don’t plan to reward them by putting another penny into the club. They are part of the con – actors in a farce akin to World of Sport wrestling. I recognise my own emotional attachment, but I’m realistic about the future. I don’t think I’ll care much about Celtic in 10 or 20 years if it continues to accelerate down this road of a soulless corporate shell. Desmond can do one anytime. Loathsome man.

jimthetim53

Maestro Fan, ‘A Loathsome man’? I think you are being too kind. I would put DD & PL’s popularity amongst Celtic supporters on a par with Oliver Cromwell & King Billy.

auldheid

Big Audio Dynamite

The article by Phil Mac Giolla Bhain at

https://philmacgiollabhain.ie/2020/01/20/a-familiar-type-of-exclusive/

tells just how closely linked we were in 2011.

The e mail correspondence was in Feb 2011 .

It supports the idea Celtic were aware of Rangers financial plight and feared the consequences of their demise.

Now had Malmo lost to Rangers there would have been no administration with CL money coming in tranches.

In fact in one document where a meeting was being arranged with HMRC in 2011 to discuss paying the wtc bill, , an HMRC official suggested the meeting be after a result either the Malmo or Maribor game, signifying that HMRC recognised the ability to pay depended on UEFA money.
In the early days Celtic’s resistance to doing the right thing about possible cheating as shareholders saw it was puzzling, but over time it became clear the last thing they wanted is the truth coming out, followed by why, followed by Celtic must have something to hide.

To this day events in 2011 remain uninvestigated, justice has still to be served and until it is, the toxin of burying the truth will debilitate Celtic.

The licence in 2011 was gained through false pretence, there is an argument Celtic are asking supporters to sign up for STs on the false pretence they are paying to watch a fair competition.

Some dont care, some do. Why is down to each individual and both their conscience and consciousness.

bada bing1

Signings so far a bit meh….I want to see this guy playing 👍

auldheid

To add to my previous..

Conscience describes two things – what a person believes is right and how a person decides what is right. More than just ‘gut instinct’, our conscience is a ‘moral muscle’. By informing us of our values and principles, it becomes the standard we use to judge whether or not our actions are ethical.17

consciousness
/ˈkɒnʃəsnɪs/

1.
the state of being aware of and responsive to one’s surroundings.
“she failed to regain consciousness and died two days later”

2.
a person’s awareness or perception of something.
“her acute consciousness of Luke’s presence”

As I said it is an individual thing and very uncomfortable when expressed in moral terms. Somewhere in scripture there is a phrase where Jesus says I come like a sword. I used to think rubbish how could a man who expresses forgiveness and love come as a sword, but no longer do I think that.

We are seeing indeed experiencing the sword in action but have nothing to fear as what is cut away sets us free.

Gordon64

‘Gradually I came to realize that people will more readily swallow lies than truth, as if the taste of lies was homey, appetizing: a habit’. Martha Gellhorn

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